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FAW and other first aid courses

Pyrene

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#1
Alright folks,

Just gathering a bit of information here.

I have heard that you no longer need an Awarding Body to be able to hold a FAW/EFA/Others course.

In other words, Joe Blogs from next door can put on a 'FAW' course and print certs out from his computer. Is this the case?

Not that I am looking to do that (we at BK will always use an awarding body...simply for quality standard) just a bit concerened that we will be having thousands of douchebags walking around with 'FAW' certs who know next to nothing
 

Oddjob

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May 12, 2008
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#2
Alright folks,

just a bit concerened that we will be having thousands of douchebags walking around with 'FAW' certs who know next to nothing
We seem to have that already.
if you put good information into a bag of shit, well,
you still have a bag of shit.
until we pre select candidates to be trained by ability and aptitude like any other part of the emergency services, we will still be represented by 'bags of shit'
 

Pyrene

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#3
i mean the bogus qualifications are accepted in workplace instead of the requirments we all know and love
 

operator144

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#4
I think your right - I believe its for the 'customer' to check that their instructor is of a good enough standard etc

That might be wrong, but I know that's how a number of companies near me view the 'new' way
 

Resusruss

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Apr 20, 2008
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#5
The HSE still are the controlling body, deregulation was to take place on the 1st April but they have moved it to, I believe October.
The HSE are not approving any more applications.

Russ
 

AdamGent

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Jun 21, 2010
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#7
Sort of.

There are three routes:

Subscribe to an Awarding Body.
The vast majority of training providers will do this so Company X trains candidates who gets certificates isssued by Awarding body Y.
This is the most familiar route and the one most customers will look at.

Trade of your Reputation.
St Jonn and the Red Cross aren't going to start paying an Awarding Organisation; they will use their reputation as a mark of quality.

Fly solo - but demonstrate Due Diligence.
Joe Bloggs can indeed start running his own courses but he must be prepared to show Due Diligence (i.e. evidence of his training - First Aid AND Teaching, insurance, quality assurance etc..)


The onus is put on the customer to decide and look for evidence of Due Dilligence if necessary. Most will have heard of the Voluntary Ambulance Orgs and most will see "Accredited by..." and all will interpret that as good quality.


Everyone is harping on about bad quality providers turning up now it is is 'unregulated'. They are already out there - accredited or not.

I will be dropping my Awarding Body for FAW in October and flying solo.

My business is an Edexcel centre but I won't be looking for accreditation for FAW. Does that make me a bad man or that my courses will now be rubbish? No - as I see it the customer is the best measure of Due Diligence; all of our paperwork is already publicly available so nothing will change there. Like most small business 90% of our work is through repeat business and word of mouth.

Good training providers are welll known and will always have work. Poor training providers are equally (if not more!) well known and go out of business.


Does being approved by an Awarding Body mean you are better? Not at all - it is not Accreitation, it is Licensing. You pay your annual fees and £ per certificate and that it is. Edexcel are pretty diligent about FPOS but once Joe Bloggs has his accreditation there is nothing to stop him using a untrained, inexperienced trainer, teaching rubbish to classes of 40 candidates, and passing them all to maintinan a 100% pass record.

The reason the HSE has stopped approving new providers is becasue they were unable to assure quality of existing ones.

Let your results speak for themselve - having half a dozen logos on the bottom of your certificates does not mean you can teach or are current, it just means you are a memebr of a lot of organisations.
 

AdamGent

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Jun 21, 2010
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#8
Sort of.

There are three routes:

Subscribe to an Awarding Body.
The vast majority of training providers will do this so Company X trains candidates who gets certificates isssued by Awarding body Y.
This is the most familiar route and the one most customers will look at.

Trade off your Reputation.
St Jonn and the Red Cross aren't going to start paying an Awarding Organisation; they will use their reputation as a mark of quality.

Fly solo - but demonstrate Due Diligence.
Joe Bloggs can indeed start running his own courses but he must be prepared to show Due Diligence (i.e. evidence of his training - First Aid AND Teaching, insurance, quality assurance etc..)


The onus is put on the customer to decide and look for evidence of Due Dilligence if necessary. Most will have heard of the Voluntary Ambulance Orgs and most will see "Accredited by..." and all will interpret that as good quality.


Everyone is harping on about bad quality providers turning up now it is is 'unregulated'. They are already out there - accredited or not.

Ideliver a range of courses but as for our FAW courses, I will be dropping my Awarding Body for FAW in October and flying solo.

Does that make me a bad man or that my courses will now be rubbish? No - as I see it the customer is the best measure of Due Diligence; all of our paperwork is already publicly available so nothing will change there. Like most small business 90% of our work is through repeat business and word of mouth.

Good training providers are welll known and will always have work. Poor training providers are equally (if not more!) well known and go out of business.


Does being approved by an Awarding Body mean you are better? Not at all - it is not Accreitation, it is Licensing. You pay your annual fees and £ per certificate and that it is. Once Joe Bloggs has his accreditation and PowerPoint presentations, there is nothing to stop him using a untrained, inexperienced trainer, teaching rubbish to classes of 40 candidates, and passing them all to maintain a 100% pass record.

The reason the HSE has stopped approving new providers is becasue they were unable to assure quality of existing ones - and this is the problem faced by all Awarding Organisations they cannot properly police their centres. The good ones do their besta nd the better ones have peer-review systems and regular trainer updates but these are not the norm.

Let your results speak for themselves - having half a dozen logos on the bottom of your certificates does not necessarily mean you can teach or are current, it just means you are a member of a lot of organisations, similarly not running an accredited course does not mean it is second rate. Candidates will work out which very quickly.
 

K9medic

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#9
There is a fourth route become a member of an industry body.

Most of the companies I work for (I’m a free lance trainer, not a training company) are thinking of offering the following options to their clients;

1- Awarding Organisation (OFQUAL / Edexcel, through Skills for Health) as has been said the most clients are going to want this option, and some insurance companies are demanding it. I know at lest two AO’s stipulating the course must be registered in advance with them and they intend to do unannounced visits.

2- Industry Body, the Federation of First Aid Training Organisations (started by Ian Kershaw MBE who ran the approvals and monitoring for the HSE) seems to be the most popular. Again they are planning unannounced visits.

3- In House, but as has been said it is up to the client to do “due diligence” to make sure the course is correct for them. If anyone is interested in what due diligence is, it is on the HSE’s website.

The AO’s are calling their EFAW a Level 2 and FAW a Level 3. This means we can only accept an AO certificate for renewal, not a STJ, Red Cross or Bob down the street certificate.

The HSE will still stipulate the course content and duration and student numbers, as well as the minimum training standards for the tutors.

If any company is offering courses that are not from a current HSE registered company or from an AO, then they are being a bit naught as the other two options don’t come into affect till the 1st of October (and there is some talk that it might be delayed again).
 
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