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HART - HAWKI Close Protection Course

D

Deleted member 33

Guest
#21
Dear All

This is obviously quite a common mindset of quite a few members. That the SIA mandatory guidelines are insufficient for training potential operatives on a CP Course before entering hostile environments.

Yes, they are but we are discussing the SIA standard. That said - a hostile environment still remains no place for a civilian that has only conducted a commercial course

The fact of the matter is that the remit of the SIA extends to the UK only, i.e. their guidelines are geared towards equipping and training those working within our borders. It is not just the course content that training providers must adhere to, it is the number of hours spent teaching this content also.

Both of which are not fit for purpose.

"Rifleman6388" made the point that if students had unlimited budgets and therefore training providers were able to produce a far longer course with all the extra training needed, then things would be a little different.

If students do their research well enough into a potential training provider, they will be able to find out whether or not that provider is merely reaching the benchmark or whether they have made the effort to reach this level and then go that stage further to gear that training towards HEs.

If a course is supposed to equip a person for operating in HEs then, for example with the Medical aspect in mind, content should obviously reach the SIA standards but then go that little bit further by explaining and exposing the students to type of injuries and traumas they are likely to encounter and ideally treat.

With CP content in mind, this is why some courses will emphasise the point of having a range package. It is not simply a case of getting rounds down a static range. Its a very physical few days learning about all the various offensive / defensive drills on foot or in vehicle etc. This final stage is not a requirement of the SIA- it is an area that, as an employer as well as a trainer, we have maximised to teach people what really needs to be known before being working overseas.

H
H, I have to say, that your comment here typifies the narrow mindedness and lack of seriousness to Close Protection as a whole. Putting HE aside, your SIA CP training doesn't meet the standard that should be met. No TP provides this in one course!Even those that push the truth do not as it is simply impossible to instruct a student to a professional workable and fit for purpose standard in the allotted time.

Re your last comment - it is a basic requirement for operating anywhere. CP does not choose where or when a BG is deployed!




Rich H
 

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#22
How much is the course?
Does this course enhance chances to gain employment with hart?
We all know hart from HE operations but is Hart a recocnised training provider?

Thanks
 

Scab

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Dec 31, 2007
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#23
Dear All

This is obviously quite a common mindset of quite a few members. That the SIA mandatory guidelines are insufficient for training potential operatives on a CP Course before entering hostile environments.

The fact of the matter is that the remit of the SIA extends to the UK only, i.e. their guidelines are geared towards equipping and training those working within our borders. It is not just the course content that training providers must adhere to, it is the number of hours spent teaching this content also.
The fact is the training minimums do not produce a fit for purpose CPO for the UK, and especially elsewhere. The minimum which MUST be adhered to, yes, true, it must be adhered to. But the standard for pass is pretty much up to the assessing instructors. If a student can barely perform their duties, have they met a minimum standard? No. If the student can perform the required duties well and demonstrate sound and in depth understanding then they earn a pass. But as said - its hard to bring a person up to scratch in the alotted times imposed by commercial requirementsl themselves imposed by the coyboy element that sprun up after CP training became mainstream following SIA meddling.

So yes, we agree (obviously) that you must reach the SIA minimums. So what? Minimums are just that. You can train people to be better than the minimums but that means more contact time and practise. So we can bow to commercial pressures (and to be fair, you must if you are to have a chance of surviving) but how TP's to inanely bleat on about SIA minimums is crap.

No one is held to maximums and minimums are just that, a minimum, not the only target. To put it into plain English for anyone having a hard time understanding a minimum is a target, but not the only target, if the minimum score out of ten is a five, and that is the minimum score set by the SIA, that is not to say a TP cannot train for an eight. Or heaven forbid, a ten.
 
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Plissken8

Guest
#24
I wonder how many blokes, (especially ex-mil, who weren't SF or CPU) who do this course get offered work by HART?
Not many.
eduacated guess.
Can't believe it took them this long to tap into the HEPCO gold mine.
 
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