Hired guns secure ships, stir controversy (Stars and Stripes)

Redfour,

On my BA flight out to my contract I was fortunate or unfortunate depending how you look at it to be sitting next to some bigwig in a seafares union. He was on his way for a marsec conference in Athens and we got chatting, he stated catergorically that British seamen did not want armed guards on the their ships. The reasons he gave were as follows, the crew feared it would provoke and attack through intimidation, if the guards had guns the prirates would get bigger guns and the situation would escalate, they did not wish to be involved in a fire fight.

I'm no Marsec expert but he was interested in my views and how British security guys conduct themselves (professionally). He admitted that he had never discussed these issues with anyone from the Marsec industry and I perceived he was niaive. I formed the opinion that many British seamen are ill informed regarding mearsures to protect vessels and how much of a deterrent armed guards can have.


Cheers
 
Prometheus, I agree re: the naivety, but as far as I've seen British seamen are in the minority these days in the sense that theres more Philipinos, Eastern Europeans, Greeks etc etc at sea now. Maybe they have a different view to firearms? :confused:

It seems most flags are following the IMO guidance not to have weapons on ships due to the eroneous "things may escalate" argument. :(

Having said all that, I dont think ALL vessels need armed protection taking into consideration the speed, freeboard & levels of defensive measures in place etc
 
Having just stepped off a 240 mtr LOA 10mtr freeboard VLCC - that was crewed by greek officers with 20 filipinos and along with the many many other vessels we arm - i personally would say that the unions and shore based staff have a completely detached view as far as the crew are concerned - just about every crew we embark with.... and to be honest i cant remember the last british crew in that region...they all would prefer arms onboard...we are now at time for the next 4 weeks where i would expect another 4/6 ships hijacked but thankfully then the monsoon winds will come in - however expect attacks still to happen upto and exceeding 20 knots of wind sea state 3/4.

IMHO the navy's have now made the situation a very bad one....... up till now they were seen as a good thing and they certainly do a good job when they are in the right place at the right time - but they have done a few things now that is a catalyst for disaster....:
1. Displaced the threat to the whole IOR
2. Shown to the pirates they are now immune from prosecution or arrest
3. Shown contempt as to the use that professional private security could afford the merchant shipping industry.
4. Raised the profile and modus operandi for others to follow globally
5. We now have had attacks in Vietnam / Cameroon that are showing signs of following the lead of Somalia..

I forecast a huge resurgence for private security in this industry before year end for shipping - but i tried a long time ago to offer chairing / implementing a code of conduct and insurance approval database of maritime sec co's - but only 1 of the big 3 were keen to sign up........ It will need funding and organising properly but the rewards i think will show healthy returns...... See you tomorrow if your there...!
 
Merchant Maritime Warfare Centre said:
the many other vessels we arm
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Thought the philiosophy at the MMWC was the non-lethal layered approach. Your comment suggests you are 'arming' a number/many vessels :confused:

Just thought I'd ask the question to clear up my confusion (& nayone else's) & your stance on the matter as I think thats what this thread is about?

Cheers

p.s. thought you were a bit harsh on the good old coalition who are trying to do a job with heavy political constraints. Not trying to start a barney, just my opinion
 
Sanddancer said:
Thought the philiosophy at the MMWC was the non-lethal layered approach. Your comment suggests you are 'arming' a number/many vessels :confused:

Just thought I'd ask the question to clear up my confusion (& nayone else's) & your stance on the matter as I think thats what this thread is about?

Cheers

p.s. thought you were a bit harsh on the good old coalition who are trying to do a job with heavy political constraints. Not trying to start a barney, just my opinion
Click to expand...

Hi Sanddancer,

Apologies as i should be clear when wearing the two different hats.......

As the owner of Gulf ofAden Group Transits Gulf of Aden Group Transits: Home we do place many armed teams on vessels in the region and have just expanded the portfolio to Mombassa and into the Persian Gulf - not just using Yemen Navy along the Yemen coastline or in the IRTC and in this regard as the owner of this company i was referring.

As to navies....you are 100% correct in that their hands are more or less completely tied - and that when they are close they are a huge help..but 100+ vessels a day in that region and only 30 grey boats dotted around - the odds are now greatly in favour of the pirates due to the continued process of deter and disarm rather than capture and sentence in criminal law.....

The navies have created a situation that by fact and demonstration has fuelled the fire to make pirates come out in droves.......... After all whats the worse that can happen if they get caught - they lose their weapons, get a slap on the wrist and sent home in at least 1 of their own boats........

The navy do a great job, and the guys onboard would love nothing more that to go out and pop a few off - but we have to look at reality and from the simple view of the Somali'a - nothing to lose.....! Sorry for the confusion - guilty as charged :eek:
 
Nick,

if the Yemeni coast guard are not on your vessels, who carries out the armed/unarmed protection since you have expanded into the Gulf and to Mombasa if you dont mind me asking?
 
Merchant Maritime Warfare Centre said:
Hi Keith,

We only use the coastguard in exceptional circumstances - our prime supplier is the Yemen Navy :D ....our press release on how we are operating the other routes will come out shortly :cool:
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If anyone knows the indian ocean you would know thier is only at moment 5 places to arm vessels, Nick come to the light. The navy is not very well trained like the YCG. We can help you with this, i do believe joe will be by you next week.

Charles
 
redfour said:
what a bunch of wankers, another ****ing bw there, typical septic tanks. The industry backs away from this type of gung ho approach, and we sit back and laugh. Dream on shitheads this isnt Iraq
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Good day

I am a freelance journalist, working independently, investigating Stolen Valour in the USA and around the world. Currently we have almost completed enough USA investigations for the first series of articles and are now widening the net further afield, to encompass the UK.

Mr McManus has been the subject of several allegations of improperly running a company with regards to personnel insurance and payments, allegedly falsifying his CV and allegedly exaggerating his military background.

The main issue that I will be highlighting, should the facts support the allegations is whether Mr McManus has put lives at risk by purporting to be an expert in the field of security, when in fact he may possibly have had minimal military training whatsoever. If the allegations are not proven, we will make a full disclosure and apology to Mr McManus for the inconvenience.

Several Independent sources have informed us that Mr McManus has allegedly made claims in the past, which he is unwilling or unable to verify. Claims such as having been a member of the British Parachute Regiment. Claims that he served with several Intelligence units attached to special forces. Claims that he was a commissioned officer. The list goes on.

If you have any information to support or refute these allegations we would love to hear from you. If you served in any of these units or any others with Mr McManus we'd love to hear from you too.

Thank-you for your support.

Tom Smith

tsmith.investigator@tuta.io
 
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