Instructor Information DS course

S

Summer

Longterm Registered User
I just found this out and I am gobsmacked as to how ridiculous this truly is.

With the introduction of PI to the DS course we are required to sit yet another instructor training course. However and this is the kicker. I teach a great deal for companies who use the SAFE program through Edexcel.

I have just found out that if one has a Level 3 PI instructor qualification from the likes of Maybo, or anyone else for that matter it will not allow you to teach the SAFE program unless you do a conversion course. SAFE are working with CALM on their PI section and I am now competely restricted as to which PI Instructor qual I can do.

Didnt know if anyone knew this already, but thought it might have an impact on those freelance trainers that sometimes have to teach the SAFE program and those training providers that pay for the SAFE DS course.
 
Double check that info with the S.I.A , I am of the understanding that all the awarding bodies have an agreement that as long as you do one of the Train the Trainer physical intervention / control and restraint approved courses you can deliver all the various approved techniques. I am going to attend the N.F.P.S course in Scotland at the end of june. Hope this info helps.
 
phoenix1 said:
Double check that info with the S.I.A , I am of the understanding that all the awarding bodies have an agreement that as long as you do one of the Train the Trainer physical intervention / control and restraint approved courses you can deliver all the various approved techniques. I am going to attend the N.F.P.S course in Scotland at the end of june. Hope this info helps.
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Nope sorry, spoke to the woman at SAFE about it this afternoon before posting this for clarification, it is true.

It is being done because the SAFE training program varies from other programmes, as they all do, but SAFE will be registering the instructors individually as well as the centres. If the TP's using the SAFE module want to teach the DS course all but the SAFE PI section and teach a non SAFE program for the PI thats fine, its a separate qualification for the student as far as awarding bodies go, but if the TP's want to use the full SAFE program as they have been previously then those instructors will have to do the SAFE instructor program or a relevant conversion.

Basically if I do the SAFE instructor program then I can teach the PI section in any DS course unless a Maybo qualification is specifically required by the employing training provider but not the other way round. I hope that makes sense.
 
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Yes you are quite correct we have have one trainer who has the same problem as yourself he ended up completing another course as he did not like being forced.Especially as the spec if the same for all the Level 3 quals so there should not be any changes.Lastly anyone know of any Pi instructors sho are avialble for training PM me please
 
Sorry Guys, but I think phoenix is correct

My understanding from working with 5 awarding bodies is that,

"if you are accepted by one awarding body, then this automatically accepts you as being competent to deliver any of the other awarding bodies PI"
 
acnotpc said:
Sorry Guys, but I think phoenix is correct

My understanding from working with 5 awarding bodies is that,

"if you are accepted by one awarding body, then this automatically accepts you as being competent to deliver any of the other awarding bodies PI"
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Not if you use at any point the SAFE Physical Intervention training materials because the instructors have to register with SAFE as well. Believe me on this one. I promise you the information is accurate.

SAFE isn't an awarding body, it provides training materials and it is their stipulation that if their materials are used for PI then the instructor must have either done their entire course or a conversion.
 
SAFE are obviously trying to tie people into doing their Trainers course or one similar , which if you enquire what that is you will see they have an agreement with the other party , what i was saying is as far as the Awarding bodies go , they say as long as you have the P.I Trainer qualification , you can deliver the P.I unit of the Door course , there is a basic agreement in place what should be getting taught on this part of the course.
 
phoenix1 said:
SAFE are obviously trying to tie people into doing their Trainers course or one similar , which if you enquire what that is you will see they have an agreement with the other party , what i was saying is as far as the Awarding bodies go , they say as long as you have the P.I Trainer qualification , you can deliver the P.I unit of the Door course , there is a basic agreement in place what should be getting taught on this part of the course.
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There are quite a few physical intervention programmes but not all of them are PI related to working in the Private Security Industry, which are new programmes written to meet said requirements. The ones that are accepted by the awarding bodies will be "across the board" so once accepted to deliver through one awarding body, then you will automatically be able to deliver for others delivering the PSI qual
 
Ugh. SAFE's DS package is a pile of crap anyway.

- Grossly overloaded with irrelevant info for teh grassroots DS
- WRONG on some points
- Too much info on some points
- Too little info on others
- Constant mindless repetition
- Watermarked images obviously just stolen from Google images
- Numerous spelling and grammar mistakes (not that I am one to talk on that note but at least I run my materials through a spell check!)

And now; trying to tie you to them with the PI training?? BS.
God knows what their PI package is going to be like.
 
Scab said:
Ugh. SAFE's DS package is a pile of crap anyway.

- Grossly overloaded with irrelevant info for teh grassroots DS
- WRONG on some points
- Too much info on some points
- Too little info on others
- Constant mindless repetition
- Watermarked images obviously just stolen from Google images
- Numerous spelling and grammar mistakes (not that I am one to talk on that note but at least I run my materials through a spell check!)

And now; trying to tie you to them with the PI training?? BS.
God knows what their PI package is going to be like.
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Couldn't agree more, I use it for one client at the moment and the pages contradict each other, there are mistakes throughout. I will let you know what the PI package is like when I see it. The instructor training is done in association with CALM who i understand do alot in the NHS sector.
 
Now I'm really confused !

I teach the door course via EdExcel and use my own programme which was developed from the SAFE programme.

When I heard about the PI part of the training I booked myself on to the NFPS course as it was EdExcel approved. I am now assuming that I can 'Carry on normal jogging' with regards to teaching the door, is this wrong ?????

Also has ANYONE had ANY course material for the NEW door course with the extra modules ? SAFE are still selling the door course material, but refuse to tell me if it covers the new modules or it is still the old (Pre June 2010) package. If there is a new package out there, where can you get it from PLEASE ?
 
Now I'm REALLY Confused !!

I teach the door course for EdExcel and when I heard that the new elements included PI I promptly booked myself on the NFPS course as it EdExcel approved.

The programme I use is my own developed from the SAFE presentation over a few years, so are you guys now saying that I will not be able to teach the door for EdExcel having completed the NFPS Course ???

Also has anyone managed to obtain ANY new training material for the 'New' course with the 'new' modules ? I have asked SAFE several times, who are still selling 'Door Course presentations' if they contain the new modules, but have not had a straight answer. I dont want to spend money on the old package !
 
Jacko7612 said:
Now I'm REALLY Confused !!

I teach the door course for EdExcel and when I heard that the new elements included PI I promptly booked myself on the NFPS course as it EdExcel approved.

The programme I use is my own developed from the SAFE presentation over a few years, so are you guys now saying that I will not be able to teach the door for EdExcel having completed the NFPS Course ???

Also has anyone managed to obtain ANY new training material for the 'New' course with the 'new' modules ? I have asked SAFE several times, who are still selling 'Door Course presentations' if they contain the new modules, but have not had a straight answer. I dont want to spend money on the old package !
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There has been so much contradicting information over the last few months, I don't think even the awarding bodies know whats going on with it. What I know now is that if you, and forget the awarding bodies here, if you plan use the SAFE PI training materials to teach your DS course then you will be using the CALM program and therefore will have to do the CALM instructor course. Haven't got a damn clue how it is working for anything else :D
 
Thanks all,
Scab, know what your saying about building my own, as thats what I do now, but am looking for direction on EXACTLY what to teach for the new modules, which I believe are;
Dealing with under 18s
The terrorist threat
PI
Is this correct do you know ?

And how do we find out EXACTLY what to teach and when ? Please dont tell me we have to wait for the test papers to come to us and adapt the training to fit the tests !?!?!?!?

Thanks
 
Did you get the P.I. presentation module from N.F.P.S when you did the instructors course, i got everything i need to deliver the P.I.unit. There is a company who can licence you the new Door Supervisor course if needed. I got the new D.S course from a company called ftts , forward thinking training solutions , it is a very well put together course , look them up on the internet , if contacting them ask for Dave Stanley , tell him Rodger from Scotland suggested calling to enquire about getting the new style D.S course from him. If i can of any further help let me know , Cheers , Phoenix1
 
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