Enquiries on my company

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Anazoth

Full Registered User
Hey, i have a few questions about the client that i am currently working for through my security company, names will not be given for obvious reasons.

My current company has approximately 20-30 CCTV cameras on it's premises including a few PTZ. People are constantly coming into site including visitors, contractors and general public and it is home to a lot engineering factories. There is also a control room which has access to the controls and CCTV cameras to all of the sites throughout the country for said company.

Now that the brief explanation is over, here comes the question. Should the guards have CCTV licenses in this company and should the control room operatives be licensed? I believe that they should and have been having an ongoing debate with fellow guards about this. What are your views? also what laws (if any) is it breaching?

One more question, the bosses installed a CCTV camera into all the guards offices to spy on us, is this a breach of the human rights act or any other laws? It is making work very uncomfortable for us as they are constantly watching the cameras, apparently they have access to the cameras from their home aswell. They say it's for health and safety but there is always guards on duty together and we carry a radio when on patrol with a loneworker system (if it tilts for too long an alarm goes to comms)
 
There is a lot of "Grey" when it comes to the Public Space CCTV licence but my take on it is that you do NOT need a CCTV licence for the role you state above. A DS or SG licence is more than enough.
Yes you may have members of the public about but the CCTV licence is intended for those that cover what most of us would understand as a "public space" and use the CCTV for many different reasons that you would.

As for the other part it all depends what you naughty boys and girls have been up to:) and what exactly you mean by the guards office. Have a read of this by the ICO.
ICO - CCTV code of practice
 
@Des

No, i am a casual officer (although working 72 hours this week lol) and ironically enough the only one licensed :D

@Rhea

The PTZ cameras are at the entrance / exits of the premises and look up and down the public roads outside of the property. If this is allowed then I honestly have no idea what the CCTV license is actually for.

As for what we have been up to, our shift is 12 hours long. We both go out on patrols that last 4 hours so the rest of the night we are stick in the gate house (guard office lol) doing nothing. They seem to have a problem with us using laptops / mobile phones and even a kindle! we aren't allowed to read and basically have to spend 8 hours staring at the wall. This is extremely boring as you can imagine and causes you to doze off and be unable to concentrate.

You might say that we are there for work and not to be entertained but the problem is that there is NO work for us to do, unless someone comes in at 4am then that takes 30 seconds out of our night.
 
Also the camera in the gatehouse is pointing directly to us at our desk and is on constant watch on us at all times. This completely goes against the ICO code of practice. They said it's for health and safety but as i previously said, you have a partner who is always in contact with you, the comms operator is in constant contact through phone and radio, there's a lone worker system in place for when your partner is on patrol, there is a static camera pointing to the gatehouse entrance and there is a PTZ that can actually zoom into the gatehouse.

It's obviously just a spy-cam.
 
you can always phone up the Information Commissoner's Office, you may get some helpful info. You can also check, by going onto their web-site, that the CCTV scheme is registered. This information is open to the public.
 
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Anazoth said:
The PTZ cameras are at the entrance / exits of the premises and look up and down the public roads outside of the property. If this is allowed then I honestly have no idea what the CCTV license is actually for.
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As ever the SIA do not explain it very well and if you ask them you come away even more confused. In your job you are using the CCTV to identify a trespasser or to protect property. Therefore you do not need a licence. Although the guys that cover the public spaces do the same as you they can also do a hell of a lot more and therefore need the CCTV licence. Didn't they cover any of this on your course?

Anazoth said:
You might say that we are there for work and not to be entertained but the problem is that there is NO work for us to do, unless someone comes in at 4am then that takes 30 seconds out of our night.
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If you have read the link to the ICO and are still not happy then give them a ring or have a chat to ACAS Acas - Acas Helpline
but just be careful with making statements like "No work for us to do" as the cameras may just prove there is no need for an "us" any more.
 
This may answer your question in regards to the gatehouse camera:

Employers are permitted to monitor workers in so far as this is necessary and proportionate to management’s reasons for so doing. CCTV monitoring at the workplace is often undertaken for security reasons and in most circumstances is viewed as reasonable. If the surveillance was excessive, the implications may vary depending on whether your employer is a public or private body or individual.

Under the Data Protection Act any CCTV monitoring must normally be open and there should be good reasons for your employer or others to do it. Your employer should carry out an assessment of its effects before allowing its use.

In general, if employees feel that the use of CCTV is intrusive they can ask their union (if relevant) to assist. Expressing your concerns to your employer and seeking to compromise may be the easiest way to resolve the situation.

If your employer is a public body, they have an obligation to respect your right to privacy (Article 8) under the Human Rights Act 1998 (HRA). However, this right is a qualified right, which means that it may be interfered with when such interference is in accordance with law, for a legitimate purpose (e.g. to prevent crime, for public safety) and the interference is proportionate in trying to achieve the necessary aim. For example, in some situations, CCTV cameras may be necessary for security reasons in certain places. They may also be used to investigate and prevent crimes. An example of disproportionate use may arguably be where cameras were put in toilets or changing

If your employer is a private organisation or company, then you cannot directly rely on the HRA. However, in all contracts of employment, there is an implied term that employers will not without reasonable and proper cause conduct themselves in a manner calculated or likely to destroy, or seriously damage, the relationship of confidence and trust between themselves and employees. However, it is unlikely that CCTV cameras in obvious places in the workplace would breach this implied term.
 
as i allways say to them who have a go at me for watching them around the store if you have nothing to hide why should you care im watched at work by my control room who cares dont fall asleep do your job
 
larpy said:
This may answer your question in regards to the gatehouse camera:

Employers are permitted to monitor workers in so far as this is necessary and proportionate to management’s reasons for so doing. CCTV monitoring at the workplace is often undertaken for security reasons and in most circumstances is viewed as reasonable. If the surveillance was excessive, the implications may vary depending on whether your employer is a public or private body or individual.

Under the Data Protection Act any CCTV monitoring must normally be open and there should be good reasons for your employer or others to do it. Your employer should carry out an assessment of its effects before allowing its use.

In general, if employees feel that the use of CCTV is intrusive they can ask their union (if relevant) to assist. Expressing your concerns to your employer and seeking to compromise may be the easiest way to resolve the situation.

If your employer is a public body, they have an obligation to respect your right to privacy (Article 8) under the Human Rights Act 1998 (HRA). However, this right is a qualified right, which means that it may be interfered with when such interference is in accordance with law, for a legitimate purpose (e.g. to prevent crime, for public safety) and the interference is proportionate in trying to achieve the necessary aim. For example, in some situations, CCTV cameras may be necessary for security reasons in certain places. They may also be used to investigate and prevent crimes. An example of disproportionate use may arguably be where cameras were put in toilets or changing

If your employer is a private organisation or company, then you cannot directly rely on the HRA. However, in all contracts of employment, there is an implied term that employers will not without reasonable and proper cause conduct themselves in a manner calculated or likely to destroy, or seriously damage, the relationship of confidence and trust between themselves and employees. However, it is unlikely that CCTV cameras in obvious places in the workplace would breach this implied term.
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Very true and very well explained.

The HRA and DPA does act to some extent to stop a big brother state. Recent panorama on BBC 1 about CCTV cameras used for traffic violations also explains this very well (on BBC iplayer)
 
Is the camera system used to record events or do you have an officer to monitor? Who reviews the recorded images?

Is the work space covered by CCTV a dedicated security office or do visitors/other employees book in & out through that loc.
 
Excuse the late entrance on this one, but I've just picked up the thread, not normally being too concerned about little things like CCTV legislation. :)

the bosses installed a CCTV camera into all the guards offices to spy on us, is this a breach of the human rights act or any other laws? It is making work very uncomfortable for us as they are constantly watching the cameras, apparently they have access to the cameras from their home aswell. They say it's for health and safety but there is always guards on duty together and we carry a radio when on patrol with a loneworker system (if it tilts for too long an alarm goes to comms)

Errrmmm...excuse me, but aren't we in the surveillance business ? If you're feeling uncomfortable at being under continual surveillance, how the hell can you justify a job where you're keeping a site and it's staff, customers, etc, under the same 24/7 surveillance ?

The employer does have a point, saying its for 'Health & Safety' etc. Wouldn't a Guard Post be the first point of attack, should some urban warrior decide to attack the site ?

Personally, I find the whole point of 'mass' CCTV surveillance extremely distasteful and intrusive., and merely displaces criminal behaviour to where CCTV isn't in operation.

Targeted surveillance, is a whole different story. :)

V
 
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