Minded to refuse..

M

mattwwfc

New Member
Hi all, i recently applied for my SIA badge after completing my training, i have checked my application progress online today and my current status is minded to refuse, What does this actually mean? will i not get my badge? will i have to appeal? on my CRB i have common assault sec 39, Battery x 2 sec 39, If i can appeal do you think the decision will be overturned?

Sorry for all the questions, i hope they can be answered to hopefully put my mind at ease, Thanks in advance.

Matt
Wolverhampton.
 
Go to search bar at top and type in 'minded to refuse', there are honestly some great past threads on the subject that should really help you out with what to do next etc. Good luck :)
 
dazbo1218 said:
how long ago were your convictions ?
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Posted via Mobile Device


My name is Peter Sutcliffe,
I have recently received a minded to refuse from the SIA.
Could I appeal.
I have also been banned from doing wood work.


Why do you think you've been refused.
And in all honesty, do you really think this is the right job for you.
sorry, I don't, from the little I know of you.
More and more we seem to be asked by wife/girlfreind/mother beaters or uncontrollable drink/drug convicted if they could appeal.
There's enough jacket fillers in the job, so the SIA can afford to be very choosy.
Would you want someone with your record looking after your daughter.
I don't.
 
the surprising part of this for me is that this first post is more often than not about the same subject. It makes me ask myself, Does this person have another CPW account and posted an anonymous post?

An introduction would go a long way.

Tapmaster
 
On a slightly different note, a family aquaintance rang me recently to pick my brains in relation to a mate of theirs "Yeh right" this friend had a caution for possession of a prohibited firearm i.e. a 9mm pistol. They did the course this year through HCIP but did not consider checking first if this caution which was about 10 years ago would stop them obtaining a licence. It appears it probably has in which the individual has some how managed to land an RST role in Cannes for 3 months possibly longer.

This guy has no previous security, police or military back ground and has somehow bull shitted his way onto the circuit. I think he can forget work in the UK without a licence unless some numpty employs him. He has a phd in the walter muppet school of bullshitters, at wedding this year it got back to me from a reliable source that he told people he was ex H.

As OJ implied there are some really good operators who cannot break into the industry and plenty of muppets who have. The Jobcentre , SIA and TP's aren't concerned.

Rant over!!!!!!!!!
 
mattwwfc said:
My last conviction was 2007.
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Posted via Mobile Device

so can we assume that you have a continuing history of violence over a period of time.
And these convictions don't relate to one single incident.
I thought convictions were spent after 5 years.
If you do have a pattern of violence, When are you due to offend next ?
These convictions relate to incidents where you were caught , tried and found guilty.
Can we assume that there is more either not proven or undiscovered, as is the way with most criminals I have encountered.
I'm giving you a rough ride, as I feel you represent a section of applicants that come to CPW apparentley unable to understand the punishment and restrictions due to them by way of their guilt, proven guilt.
Again I fall back to the statement would the other emergency services , police, fire , medic find your record acceptable ,
if not why should we.
If we are to gain respect and elevation the industry as a whole must surely be beyond reproach.
 
Last conviction in 2007.. there's your problem, it's less than 5 years ago so you've got very little chance of getting a licence granted. i'd think it's not even worth trying to appeal it!!!
 
I am with OJ on this one. What I don't understand is why the security industry would be forced to take someone like this? Last conviction in 2007? hmmmmmmm so does that mean that there are several other convictions out there.

My fear would be is that this person gets a license and manages to bluff his way on a job. Security is a position of extreme trust. It is work that should not be taken for granted. But, for some reason it is. Oh by the way since the police, fire and ems don't want them. Why not just give them an SIA license?


Tapmaster
 
tapmaster said:
I am with OJ on this one. What I don't understand is why the security industry would be forced to take someone like this? Last conviction in 2007? hmmmmmmm so does that mean that there are several other convictions out there.

My fear would be is that this person gets a license and manages to bluff his way on a job. Security is a position of extreme trust. It is work that should not be taken for granted. But, for some reason it is. Oh by the way since the police, fire and ems don't want them. Why not just give them an SIA license?


Tapmaster
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I agree wholeheartedly, with more and more "minded to refuse" posts showing up for first time posts.Especially violent form on a DS license ^^

Would it not be better to put on the front of the SIA web site or training providers website IN LARGE PRINTabout the CRB checks that are part and parcel of security work.

We want rid of the knuckle draggers and criminal element and not giving advice on how to get a license on an appeal !!

Once again the SIA should stand firm on their original decisions and have the a no appeal system.

NASH..
 
I've done some front of house work at the jobcentre and I kid you not that many unemployed people think they can just walk into a security job. Many times individuals have approached me or the customer service desk to ask what does SIA stand for? How do I get an SIA licence? Up until recently the job centre would cover all costs but with budget cuts there will be very few SIA courses free. Unfortunately its too late to shut the stable door after the horse as bolted. Over the last several years SIA courses for longterm unemployed have been given out like smarties.

I had a guy approach me once full of tattoo's but it was type and location that led me to believe this guys got form. He asked me straight out, will I have to have a CRB check? I replied yes but it depends what you've done.

He replied I was convicted of Robbery!!! His conviction may be spent but it is doubtful he will obtain a licence.

I made enquiries with job centre staff about their knowledge of the SIA and requirements and most I spoke to knew nothing about it but would refer jobseekers to the website. they said they did not need to know about it.

So the job centre have been refering muppets, numpties, knuckle draggers, fcukwits, arseholes, plonkers, jacket fillers, boneheads, fannies and bullshitters to undertake SIA SG/DS courses courtesy of the txpayer. Most are still unemployed and haven't taken up work because they don't want to and others have been unable to hold down a job.

So the SIA have cleaned up the criminal element but the vacuum has been filled by the above.
 
not trying to be funny but what else would MINDED TO REFUSE mean??????????? if it was minded to grant would these questions be asked????? my advice would be to try again in 2012 as anytime before then it is unlikely to even be considered ...........................

regards

daz
 
whilst on this subject ...................... does everyone think that anyone with a criminal record should just be refused full stop? i get the impression reading some posts that this is the general opinion IF YOU HAVE A RECORD THEN YOU DONT DESERVE A LICENCE!!! i am 36 and married with 3 kids, have held down responsible jobs since leaving school and am currently at college starting out on a degree in engineering. i have a criminal record and am not by any means proud of it ( a couple of idiotic things when i was younger) does this mean that i should be refused employment in a job that i 1. LOVE and 2. AM DAMN GOOD AT. i worked on the doors for 8 years before SIA regulations came into play WITHOUT any problems , i was supervisor in a nightclub and head doorman of 4 city centre pubs before i had to leave due to a couple of silly charges ( 1 was assault and the other possession of an offensive weapon ) i wont try and defend my actions as i know that they were stupid but i will say that both times had mitigating circumstances. i have been punished and learnt the error of my ways :D
 
dazbo1218 said:
whilst on this subject ...................... does everyone think that anyone with a criminal record should just be refused full stop? i get the impression reading some posts that this is the general opinion IF YOU HAVE A RECORD THEN YOU DONT DESERVE A LICENCE!!! i am 36 and married with 3 kids, have held down responsible jobs since leaving school and am currently at college starting out on a degree in engineering. i have a criminal record and am not by any means proud of it ( a couple of idiotic things when i was younger) does this mean that i should be refused employment in a job that i 1. LOVE and 2. AM DAMN GOOD AT. i worked on the doors for 8 years before SIA regulations came into play WITHOUT any problems , i was supervisor in a nightclub and head doorman of 4 city centre pubs before i had to leave due to a couple of silly charges ( 1 was assault and the other possession of an offensive weapon ) i wont try and defend my actions as i know that they were stupid but i will say that both times had mitigating circumstances. i have been punished and learnt the error of my ways :D
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Why should our standards be any less than that of a policeman.?
Keep in mind in saying this that there are policemen out there with criminal records,
but rarely if not at all when applying for entry to the force.
Under the rehabilitation rules you arenot penalised throughout your whole life.
But many of the enquiries are from those that still possess unspent convictions.
The key to all this is to fight for your job, as a policeman does, get legal representation, and I mean GOOD legal representation have it ready in advance, research and get the very best you can,
we work in a sometimes violent job, so disputes over what happened will occur.
Best make sure our side of the story is heard and respected.
If we had a union or association, maybe we would have better representation as well as better standards.
But right now the SIA are the guvenors and what they say , should go.
I have worked doors , cleared squats, collected debts, CP and have encountered conflict often.
But still I have a clean record. It ain't by chance, I can assure of that.
Some of the best security Ive worked with have 'made mistakes' as you put it.
They also learned their lessons often the hard way, and lost time in the past, but they have been some of the best operators I have ever worked with.
Converseley some of the most dishonest and useless operators have been ex- Met or RMP.
Generalisations are a one cap fits all, and hence rarely fits anyone.
But in all honesty some people just aren't suited to the job, and some bench mark needs to be set.
so either don't be foolish and make mistakes or be clever enough not to get caught.
Failing that get a bloody good brief and check the camera angles.
Kaim Todner is a good start in this department
good luck and stay safe.


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A simple way of dealing with all these minded to refuse etc..... Anyone attending any SIA course... CP,DS,SG,CCTV etc. it should be made compulsary to check onto course with a current CRB check...... No CRB check, no course..... Discrepancies.... no course until the discrepancy is resolved with the SIA before being allowed to undertake a course.

Ear defence firmly in place awaiting the incoming from certain TP's

Jaz oot
 
spot on jaz, on the course that i attended i did take along a subject access printout from the police. the trainer did advise me that i may not get a badge due to a couple of small things................. thankfully i did, but there were other guys there that had absolutely no chance and were only there as the course wasnt costing them anything ( being paid by job centre etc , i paid for my own course and was aware of the chance i was taking)
 
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